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ChessandCheck's Message:

i'm all for solidarity, but nothing in this thread went so far south to justify closing it down. we are in this together and we need to be able to share perspectives across political and cultural lines, but it strikes me as burying our heads in the sand to pretend that political climates do not directly affect us as employees.

as to the question, i can see the argument either way. education is so important, but we work in a uniquely challenging environment without the inherent protections of other industries. apa said they consider returning to school safe and necessary for children, but they are not considering the well-being of those necessary to educate children in their statement, and there is nothing based on experience that convinces me we won't be at high risk if we return.

and yes, to make this political, i think the smartest thing is to keep schools closed as much as absolutely possible, with a political and financial commitment to make it right for children when we all return. we're one of the richest countries in the world - an investment in people, ensuring everyone's health, financial, and educational well-being, is doable. but that is not something those with power are willing to do, and too many believe the narrative that it's not possible.

eta - why the fear of reasoned, respectful political discussion, when that's a big part of what we are living through right now? all of us?

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Discussion Review (newest messages first)
pt2014js 07-13-2020 05:44 PM

I would feel like a sitting duck, waiting for the virus to land on me.
We already know that the medical people need the protective gear and there is not enough to go around especially if all the teachers start needed protective gear too.
and students needing that, for whatever they are going to wear.
Is America ready for that demand? Don't think so.

northcalsub 07-13-2020 03:36 PM

Haley 23 Good luck with all that. I can't believe they are going to try things as an normal year. Can't wait to hear how it goes. You may all have heard LA school are going all remote. Fresno unified in the valley announced today all remote learning beginning of the year.My county has not fully decided but the clock is ticking.

bodhimom 07-12-2020 01:37 PM

I think there are posters here who think too extreme as to what they consider political. You guys have gone from one extreme to the other. Now even mentioning ppe or who is considered essential is "political," apparently.

Haley23 07-12-2020 01:01 PM

I honestly can't think of any other profession where the workers are taking on as much risk as teachers. Maybe people working in nursing homes, depending on what kind of ppe is provided?

The only workers in stores who are interacting with many customers face to face are cashiers, and that's from behind a plexiglass. Each interaction is only a couple of minutes, the customer is wearing a mask, and the customer is an adult who is not going to sneeze or cough in the worker's face. Not to mention, they're getting hazard pay right now. In many parts of the country, teachers are not only not getting hazard pay; they're actually taking cuts.

Doctors and nurses are interacting with sick people, but that is in full ppe, in a building that was built with every safety precaution in mind. They are not in a tiny room with 30 patients at once who are coughing and sneezing on them wearing a cloth mask. Not to mention, interacting with sick people is literally the exact job they signed up for. Teachers did not sign up for that.

Day care workers are the closest in risk to teachers because of the inherent risks of working with children, but even they have some protections. Day cares around here are still limiting the number of children and most have ten in each room. Since they're not charged with educating the children in their care they can spend unlimited time cleaning/sanitizing throughout the day.

So far every district around here that has announced something has announced full time/5 days per week, meaning class sizes will be normal 25-30 students and there will of course be no social distancing. Due to the nature of school, even if you try to limit interactions between different students and teachers, that can only go so far. Certain services are required including sped, EL, title 1, OT/PT, speech/language, mental health, art, music, and PE. That's a whole lot of people interacting with each other and it's impossible to say that literally only these 10 kids and this 1 teacher will interact with each other all day every day like you can do in daycare.

ChessandCheck 07-12-2020 10:20 AM

i'm all for solidarity, but nothing in this thread went so far south to justify closing it down. we are in this together and we need to be able to share perspectives across political and cultural lines, but it strikes me as burying our heads in the sand to pretend that political climates do not directly affect us as employees.

as to the question, i can see the argument either way. education is so important, but we work in a uniquely challenging environment without the inherent protections of other industries. apa said they consider returning to school safe and necessary for children, but they are not considering the well-being of those necessary to educate children in their statement, and there is nothing based on experience that convinces me we won't be at high risk if we return.

and yes, to make this political, i think the smartest thing is to keep schools closed as much as absolutely possible, with a political and financial commitment to make it right for children when we all return. we're one of the richest countries in the world - an investment in people, ensuring everyone's health, financial, and educational well-being, is doable. but that is not something those with power are willing to do, and too many believe the narrative that it's not possible.

eta - why the fear of reasoned, respectful political discussion, when that's a big part of what we are living through right now? all of us?

CC96 07-12-2020 09:04 AM

My sister and her husband are doctors and she has told me that younger children rarely spread the disease, so I think for the most part elementary teachers will be less likely to catch the virus from the students. Once you get to middle school and high school, you are probably more likely to catch it from studentsó that is where I sub.

kahluablast 07-12-2020 08:54 AM

You canít close a thread so donít worry about looking. If you want to bring it to the editors attention, you can hit the stop sign and tell them it became political and they can move it. Maybe they would remove posts, but I donít think the ones in here are posts the editor will censor.

It is a problem in these Covid days.

If it matters, I do think teachers, especially of sped and elementary are at more risk than store workers. Mid and high school might be higher risk, also just due to students doing stupid things (think Covid parties.)

CC96 07-12-2020 08:50 AM

I do not know how to close these threads either. Hopefully the 2 people who put politics into their responses will share those thoughts on the other political board. We are all here for helpful information and to be at peace with one another. Your post was a valid question and did not seem political to me.

knelson13 07-12-2020 07:08 AM

Sorry. I don't know how to close it. This was totally not intended as a political question. Just wondering how at risk we are compared to other jobs.

CC96 07-11-2020 05:29 PM

Yup, close it.😢

jakeh 07-11-2020 05:09 PM

Sweetsunset

Maybe time to close this thread. A little too heated and really not on topic. Things were fine, let's get back to 'specific' substitute questions/comment. With respect to all posters.

Sweetsunset 07-11-2020 05:05 PM

Fractured: Yes, I've been over there, I agree- it does get pretty bad in there. But that is the place for it. It can go south pretty quickly and bad here too if we don't take take care of this forum. I understand. The question had that tone. I guess, I can only hope that we don't go down that road. Let's not feed that monster lol.

Much respect,

Sweetsunset 07-11-2020 04:34 PM

I think teachers and school staff are at risk. Most have family and elderly parents to care for at home. That is a huge concern for school employees. A certain population of SPED students-- especially the medically fragile, cannot cover up their face when sneezing. They require breathing treatments twice a day during class. I know of two (high risk due to age) teachers who are set to retire if their school doesn't go remote learning. Other SPED students with behaviors challenges - as hard as we have tried to teach them- will never grasp the concept of washing hands, or distancing themselves from others. The problem with addressing the needs of these students, is that they have an IEP or a 504 plan that by law needs to be met--therefore, they need their SPED teacher. How to reconcile the need for these students and at the same time address the teacher's safety concern...

(I mostly work in a campus that only serves all levels of SPED students)

Fractured 07-11-2020 04:14 PM

It was worded as a political question. Like I said, it is connected to our jobs. Weíre adults. I can have a political conversation without getting nasty as long as everyone abides by that. I donít know if you read the Politics board, but it does get pretty bad on there.

I was basically just stating a fact over what happened a few days ago.

Sweetsunset 07-11-2020 04:03 PM

Oh brother, as soon as I read this post earlier, I feared it was going to go south.

Let's be mindful of how we craft our post. We really have a great team of teacher-subs here who look out for each other in a unique positive way- no need for politics or the hint of. Truly, these are difficult times. Please take care of yourself.

I have seen comradery here. You are all truly unique educators who -one like myself- can learn from as to how to continue to navigate the ever changing behavior and learning needs inside classroom. Please, let's not go south. Respectfully.

CC96 07-11-2020 03:16 PM

I think teachers are at greater risk because of being in smaller more enclosed spaces with a fairly static population that doesnít have the greatest ability or inclination to follow protocols.

Fractured 07-11-2020 03:15 PM

Okay, well that was not clear. We are totally more at risk. We will be inside for 8 hours a day in rooms with no ventilation and kids without masks. Weíll be lucky to get any kind of Ppe and we will most likely have to clean ourselves. No thanks.

knelson13 07-11-2020 03:10 PM

I donít think I was clear on my question. Iím not wondering if you think we are essential workers. I want to know if you think teachers are at the same risk of exposure to the virus as store employees or do you think we are at a greater risk?

Fractured 07-11-2020 03:03 PM

Well Cc, was is it when the president threatens to cut off federal funding if schools don’t open and Devos says the same thing? That’s politics and this is a political job as our funding comes from fed and state money. If you don’t like it, don’t respond. You can’t deny the federal govt is challenging Governors to open up states and threatening them if if they don’t.

Fractured 07-11-2020 03:01 PM

It is political. I could have said a lot worse, trust me. They are pushing a narrative that goes against what every health expert says is the wrong thing to do. The cdc just had their school plan leaked to the media. It says opening schools would be the worst thing to do and that virtual learning would be the safest option. An Arizona teacher just died from covid because she shared a room with her husband and one other teacher this summer to teach summer school virtually from a brick and mortar school. They used masks and all of that. The other two are now sick. Thatís with no kids. Imagine how bad the numbers will be, even if we only open up for a few weeks.


Weed shops are not essential, neither are tattoo parlors. I know places are having a hard time, but bars and restaurants are the biggest spreaders of this disease so far. Look, health food inspectors wanted to shut down meat packing plants and Trump signed an executive order making them ďessential.Ē He is sending people to their deaths, whether you want to admit it or not.

Abortion clinics should definitely be open as it is a medical procedure, Iím not going to debate that though.

Teachers should strike and not go back.

CC96 07-11-2020 02:58 PM

Jakeh, sadly there are a couple of posters here who seem to have difficulty keeping their posts non political.

jakeh 07-11-2020 02:42 PM

Quote:
Itís a false narrative being served to us by an incompetent government that doesnít care if we die.
Rather extreme and political, Fractured. Should have ended your informative post with the previous sentence IMHO.

Educators are not essential, from what I can google. That's why schools were shutdown in March. However, schools, obviously, kept many teacher in 'online education' at home.

The meaning generally applies to workers in law enforcement and public safety, food production, health care providers and emergency personnel, among others. Workers in other industries were added to the list:

Workers conducting COVID-19 research and testing.

Pharmacy employees who are necessary for filling prescriptions.

Workers who provide security services to hospitals and other critical industries.

Mass transit and airport workers.

Food and agricultural workers, to include those who work in grocery stores and restaurants. Many restaurants in a growing number of states are only providing delivery and takeout service only.

Energy sector employees considered critical to sustaining utilities, telecommunications and natural gas, among others. Gas station employees are included.

Mortuary and funeral service workers, including crematoriums and cemetery workers.

Employees who manufacture safety and sanitary products, medical equipment, pharmaceuticals, chemicals and food processing.

Workers who support national security commitments and the military.

Water and wastewater employees needed to manage drinking water supplies.

Bank employees needed to process transactions and payments, along with customer service workers at call centers. Payroll and certain insurance workers also apply. Some of those functions can be done remotely, as many companies are asking employees to work from home if possible.

Vendors that provide essential services or products like logistics, child care services, along with hardware and supply stores.

The news media.

Building cleaners and janitors.

Those who work in trash collection and disposal, animal shelters, certain warehouse and fulfillment centers, food banks and mail and shipping service centers. Certain charities also apply.

In California, employees in the cannabis industry are deemed essential. The state has enacted some of the most far-reaching measures in the country to protect its 40 million residents.

Added to these were liquor stores, abortion clinics.
Fractured 07-11-2020 02:34 PM

Essential workers is a made up term by our federal government so they could keep certain businesses running and not have the whole economy collapse. In no world are grocery workers and gas station attendants “ essential.” Frontline workers like police and doctors/medical staff are essential, but they sign up knowing there is a certain risk in their jobs.

Even then, nurses get full PPe and work in ventilated buildings with hvac. They wear clothing that they can easily take off and wash like scrubs and the get n95 masks. Teachers will not get any of these things. It’s a false narrative being served to us by an incompetent government that doesn’t care if we die.

knelson13 07-11-2020 12:51 PM

I've had people tell me that teachers and staff going back to school are no different than people who work in a grocery store or Target. I don't necessarily agree because at the store, the customers don't cough and sneeze all over you, touch you, etc. What do you all think?




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