teachers going above and beyond - ProTeacher Community




Home Join Now Search My Favorites
Help


      The VENT

teachers going above and beyond

>

Reply
 
Thread Tools
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member
teachers going above and beyond
Old 04-05-2013, 05:10 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #1

Sorry I couldn't phrase this better. Have you noticed that some teachers who are in the "in" clique go above and beyond, so then everybody else is looked down upon if they don't do the same (ridiculous) thing?

I have found this with lunch and team meetings. This year, a few of the principals' favorites regularly skip lunch to work with kids. We only have a half-hour lunch, and I find it too difficult. I need the time away from the kids to decompress, talk to my colleagues, and so forth. Now I feel like it's basically expected of everybody, so I did it a few days. I was not happy, and the kids didn't even turn in the work that I wanted them to do anyway. I do not feel like working through lunch, and a measly half-hour lunch at that, is great working conditions.

Next is team time. They don't give us ANY team time during the day, expecting us to cram in a meeting first thing in the morning. A few months ago our team leader came to us with the great idea to meet one day a week beginning at 6:15 or so. We don't have to be in the building until 7:20. Luckily, this got shot down, but just the idea that we MIGHT go for it. It's crazy. Our teachers don't even come on time to the meetings to begin with, and sorry, 6:15 is too darn early to come to school for a long-winded team meeting where we're just talked down to and thrown information at continually. I can't imagine having information thrown at me for a solid hour at 6:15 a.m. It's enough of a pain for the 20 minutes as it is.

I feel like teachers do and suggest these things because they know they're the principal's darlings and will get all the glory for anything that they do.


EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote

teenytiny's Avatar
teenytiny teenytiny is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,216
Senior Member

teenytiny
 
teenytiny's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 5,216
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 05:42 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #2

Yes, I have definitely seen this happen. I completely agree that the implication with the admin is then that everyone should do these things, and if you don't, then you are some kind of slacker. There is a major thought process around teachers that we have some kind of ethical responsibility to constantly give up our own time, our own money, and our personal lives to this job.

I refuse to do this. I do my job and I do it well, but I will not give up my lunches or excessive amounts of my personal life to this job. I am probably not my P's favorite because of it, but I am not interested in playing that game. I set parameters around what I am willing to do.
teenytiny is offline   Reply With Quote
delikate delikate is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 39
Junior Member

delikate
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 39
Junior Member
Sounds like my school
Old 04-05-2013, 06:10 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #3

Our school does something similar. "Working lunches" are what the GREAT teachers do. The mediocre ones eat lunch...in the lunchroom...with all the noise and chaos and kids. GREAT teachers pull the kids either into their rooms or to the teachers' lunch table and make the kids either give up lunch or eat it quickly so they can do work. Also, our P has created a Google doc so that the GREAT teachers can post all the GREAT things they do through the week, so that the mediocre slackers can read about how AMAZING the GREAT teachers are. Since when is tooting your own horn an admirable quality? It's not my style, and I refuse to participate. Thus, I am not a GREAT teacher. Is there a school out there that doesn't demand that we give up all our time, all our money, and all our dignity in order to be a GREAT teacher?
delikate is offline   Reply With Quote
timeforbed's Avatar
timeforbed timeforbed is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 5,010
Senior Member

timeforbed
 
timeforbed's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 5,010
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 06:10 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #4

I only see one way to win in this situation. Quietly go about doing your job and doing it well during the time you are on duty. The two I was with for a little while this year were constantly taking some kids back to their room and working with them during lunch. I wouldn't do it, and I didn't make a comment about it to them. If you really think you need that extra 30 minutes, then I don't think you're doing a very good job with the time you do have.

And why should kids give up their lunch to work anyway?
timeforbed is offline   Reply With Quote
Hariasa Hariasa is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 688
Senior Member

Hariasa
 
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 688
Senior Member
I am...
Old 04-05-2013, 06:19 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #5

lucky. At my school we don't and aren't expected to give up our lunch and our lives. If we do it is because we want to not because we are pressured to. When you go above and beyond at my school you are quietly celebrated by being allowed to leave early every now and then. Our P always thanks us at meetings for doing the things we do.

If you don't do the same things as these other teachers don't feel guilty. You are just as good. Stay to yourself and try not to worry to much about it.


Hariasa is offline   Reply With Quote
klarabelle's Avatar
klarabelle klarabelle is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 18,030
Senior Member

klarabelle
 
klarabelle's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 18,030
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 06:20 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #6

I don't think children should be giving up lunch whether its for the whole lunch time or a fraction of it. Kids need the downtime, and recognizing that makes a better teacher than a kissa$$.
klarabelle is offline   Reply With Quote
zoie's Avatar
zoie zoie is offline
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,295
Senior Member

zoie
 
zoie's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,295
Senior Member
extra work
Old 04-05-2013, 06:59 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #7

I cannot imagine getting to school at 7:20 - let alone 6:15!!! You are doing a great job - don't compare yourself to the over-achievers!
zoie is offline   Reply With Quote
BioAdoptMom3 BioAdoptMom3 is offline
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 66,881
Senior Member

BioAdoptMom3
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 66,881
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 07:09 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #8

I know what you mean and it irritates the heck out of me too! On the other hand, I comfort myself by telling myself that I am much happier when I feel respected by like co-workers/friends than I do being respected by brown nosers and administrators !

Nancy
BioAdoptMom3 is offline   Reply With Quote
1teachinaz
 
 
Guest

1teachinaz
 
 
Guest
EllyTeach
Old 04-05-2013, 07:20 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #9

In my opinion, a smart teacher takes care of his or her self so that he or she can be an effective teacher. If you need the half hour to decompress then you are smart to take it. I am exactly the same way. I need my 35 minutes away from my 30 6 year olds so I can be fresh for the afternoon.

It is unfortunate that your school has a culture of competition and favoritism. That would be a symptom of the ineffectiveness of your principal.
  Reply With Quote
kster's Avatar
kster kster is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,220
Senior Member

kster
 
kster's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 1,220
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 07:30 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #10

This is a BIG concern I have with the new evaluation systems for the future. I DO NOT see myself as a "one upper" but I have taken on much more this year than I have in the past....but this is because I had the time and stepped up to take extra roles no one else would but the previous teachers needed a break. I did not do this before because 1) new teacher- enough said and thank goodness my mentor told me DO NOT take on addition tasks while finding your grove 2) had unexpected divorce and MY CHILDREN to focus on. Now I am at stage 3...for now things are great so I can give others some help....I have staff, my coworkers that I LOVE having babies, caring for ill or aging parents, dealing with divorce...on and on. I feel good because I am helping now when I couldn't earlier but this does NOT make it the norm for being a "good teacher." We are already over worked and under paid...when will we see a balance?



Last edited by kster; 04-05-2013 at 07:55 PM..
kster is offline   Reply With Quote
GraceKrispy's Avatar
GraceKrispy GraceKrispy is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 38,073
Blog Entries: 1
Senior Member

GraceKrispy
 
GraceKrispy's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 38,073
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 07:43 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #11

My former P was like that- he made comments about certain teachers (in staff meetings) and how they were obviously great teachers because they were at school until XX time, etc. He expected us to give up lunch time (duty free by contract) freely, and stay late to do extra things because we should be "team players" who cared about kids first and foremost. He had no idea how much I worked at home or on weekends. And I got great evaluations from him every time when he visited the classroom, so his idea that we should all be doing even more was really aggravating.
GraceKrispy is offline   Reply With Quote
hiker1 hiker1 is offline
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,646
Senior Member

hiker1
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,646
Senior Member

Old 04-05-2013, 07:54 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #12

Isn't it funny that if the public got wind of the fact that some students had to have a working lunch we would be villans for making the kid work during lunch. Yet when we don't give up our lunch to help we are seen as selfish, greedy no-good-union members. You can't win.
hiker1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Tiffany's Avatar
Tiffany Tiffany is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,327
Senior Member

Tiffany
 
Tiffany's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 2,327
Senior Member
Going above and beyond
Old 04-06-2013, 03:10 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #13

This is actually part of our evaluation rubric. (Highly effective is described as: is an important member of teacher teams and committees and frequently volunteers for after-school activities.) I complained to my union president about it. This is prejudiced against women with young children at home and younger teachers who are working on completing their degree. Or how about the teachers who leave school to work a 2nd job to make ends meet? I don't feel as though this should be part of my evaluation, whether or not I volunteer for after school activities. My evaluation should be based on the hours I am required to be at work. I feel like the administrators expect us to give up our family time, otherwise we are seen as being "not highly effective." Is this expected of any other profession?
Tiffany is offline   Reply With Quote
teacherwriter teacherwriter is offline
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,905
Senior Member

teacherwriter
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,905
Senior Member
Well...
Old 04-06-2013, 05:27 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #14

I have been trying to resist responding because I'm pretty sure I'm in the minority here, but I decided to go ahead and post anyway. Why shouldn't you work extra? Why shouldn't you go above and beyond for your students? The 6:15 a.m. thing is ridiculous, I agree. (Although I once had a job where I had to report every day at 5:30 a.m., so I know I could do that once a week.) But beyond that, think about this:

We teachers are considered professionals, and as such, we are exempt from overtime pay under federal and state guidelines and our contracts. We are supposed to do whatever the job takes, regardless of how long it takes. We agree to do that when we sign our contracts. So where do we, as a profession, get off saying we "shouldn't" have to work outside of contract hours? Where do we get off saying we "shouldn't" have to squeeze in extra help for students? Huh? That's our JOB. Do other professions require this? You bet they do. Just ask any banker or business exec, journalist, physician, nurse, engineer, chef, you name it. Do other professions require parents to sacrifice time with their child to do their jobs? Yes. I have students who don't see their parents for days at a time because the parents travel for work or pull very late hours in the office. And think about the weird schedules that nurses, retail and restaurant workers keep. That's what their job requires, so they do it.

We need to be realistic: Unions are on the way out. (Not sure I like that trend, but too bad--they're not asking me.) Jobs are harder to get, and more people are competing for the ones that are available. Education is under scrutiny--much of it unfair and unfounded, but some of it logical and justifiable. If you don't want to do what the job requires, then look for something else in another field. If you want to stay in the profession and keep your job, then figure out how you can do the work and meet the responsibilities in a way that best suits you and your family. But stop complaining about how co-workers work harder than you do. It's unprofessional and makes teachers, as a group, look like a bunch of spoiled whiners.
teacherwriter is offline   Reply With Quote
dutchgirl's Avatar
dutchgirl dutchgirl is offline
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,017
Senior Member

dutchgirl
 
dutchgirl's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 4,017
Senior Member

Old 04-06-2013, 05:40 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #15

teacherwriter:
This is a vent board. Its purpose is to allow members to vent and not get scolded for it.
dutchgirl is offline   Reply With Quote
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

Old 04-06-2013, 06:00 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #16

Teacherwriter, there is going "above and beyond," like helping kids who need it, and then there is patently ridiculous. There is no evidence that cramming instruction into teacher AND student lunches---let's not forget the kids are not getting a full lunch under this scenario either---and organizing team meetings at 6:15 have ever worked or will ever work.

The examples I cited are clearly ridiculous. Getting to school a full hour and five minutes before the contracted time to have a team meeting because the administrative staff and guidance counselor are too dumb to schedule team time that was de rigueur several years ago is ridiculous. Having the kids and staff stuff food in their mouths, chowing down in ten minutes, and then working for 15 minutes on tasks that the kids could've gotten in class had they just given a darn is ridiculous. It's ineffective, too. Our principal's favorite regularly met with kids at lunch every day for about 75% of the school year. Care to guess how many passed the achievement test? If you guessed a number that starts with a z, you are correct.


Don't worry, everybody else. I appreciate the positive comments and understand that a negative comment could be just a true "company girl" seeing in my post a reflection of herself.

(By the way, I COULD get up and make it to school pretty easily. I just think that it is pointless and a waste of before-school time that could be better spent on other things. Not to mention that some teachers can't even get to school on time as it is, so they'd roll in blithely at 7, not caring about those of us who made it on time.)

Last edited by EllyTeaches; 04-06-2013 at 06:18 AM..
EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

Old 04-06-2013, 06:03 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #17

Furthermore, to the scolding poster, I don't know if the others are working HARDER. . I don't know if they are working harder or working smarter by taking lunch to get kids to do work that they wouldn't complete in class. And since when is listening to a "company girl" (principal's pet) prattle on about eighty thousand things for an hour under any definition of working harder?
EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote
teacherwriter teacherwriter is offline
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,905
Senior Member

teacherwriter
 
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,905
Senior Member
Yes, this is a vent board
Old 04-06-2013, 06:18 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #18

Just as the OP has a right to vent, so do I. And "company girl"? You're kidding, right? I'm a career changer, with experience in other careers--not a long-term tenured teacher, and definitely not the P's pet. As the P would tell you.
teacherwriter is offline   Reply With Quote
gardener5's Avatar
gardener5 gardener5 is offline
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,352
Senior Member

gardener5
 
gardener5's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,352
Senior Member
Balance
Old 04-06-2013, 06:21 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #19

is the key. Good teachers already go above and beyond. We do extras all the time because we care about the children we teach. We all could list thousands of examples, big and small. I personally don't know any effective, quality teachers who aren't already doing this. That said, there has to be a balance. We have to keep some perspective. If the new expectation is to work with kids through lunch, come way earlier for meeting, etc., I'm not a fan. If an individual teacher decides that she wants to do something because it will help a child (not because she'll score points with administration), that than that's her choice. But I don't like the idea of that becoming the "new normal" and other teachers getting messages about not measuring up.
gardener5 is offline   Reply With Quote
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

Old 04-06-2013, 06:37 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #20

I told you off (rather nicely for me) because you made some unfair generalizations and came off as a first-class scold.

I agree, Gardener. The trouble is when you know that you could do everything that is expected or go beyond and still remain invisible or disrespected by your principal, while the favorites just get more glory. For two or three years I did an activity three days a week for an hour and a half after school and was never once acknowledged by the principal for putting out a good product. They see what they want to see.

I really could care less about our principal one way or the other... until a bad evaluation from him could supersede my tenure.
EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote
twirls-a-lot's Avatar
twirls-a-lot twirls-a-lot is offline
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 605
Senior Member

twirls-a-lot
 
twirls-a-lot's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 605
Senior Member
My 2 cents...
Old 04-06-2013, 07:14 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #21

My husband is an engineer....he does all his work AT WORK. I have 2 sisters that are nurses...neither of them go in early/stay late to do their jobs....they do it during their shifts. Don't most journalists get paid per story? The few jobs mentioned: doctors and business execs get paid hefty enough salaries to warrant them working longer hours to earn their money. There is no comparison when it comes to the teaching profession.

I personally despise suck ups. They create a very competitive environment and really smother the abilities of others when no team environment exists. Shame on the principal for allowing any amount of this to take place [yes, it is happening at my school as well...new admin....making for a terrible work environment!]. Also, it should be illegal to make a student work through their lunch time....they need decompressing just as much as we do. I would never think of making a student do that as I will never work through my lunch either....I make sure my job is done when it is supposed to be done...in the classroom.

P's do see what they want to see. It's sad when they overlook the obvious good taking place.
twirls-a-lot is offline   Reply With Quote
angelteacher's Avatar
angelteacher angelteacher is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 712
Senior Member

angelteacher
 
angelteacher's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 712
Senior Member
Brown nosers, suck-ups, whatever,
Old 04-06-2013, 08:27 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #22

typically work "louder" to cover up for their own insecurities and to seek much needed kudos. Typically, they are neither working harder or smarter than other teachers. They just make a show of what they do actually do. As the pp said,
Quote:
They create a very competitive environment and really smother the abilities of others when no team environment exists. Shame on the principal for allowing any amount of this to take place [yes, it is happening at my school as well...new admin....making for a terrible work environment!].
, and it just plain STINKS for everyone, the children included.

I am a long time veteran teacher with a history of great success, but have never been a principal's favorite because I stand up for both teachers and students. I don't bend with the latest fad, and I tend to tell it like it is. I do my best by my students, and that has to be enough.
angelteacher is offline   Reply With Quote
LuBelle's Avatar
LuBelle LuBelle is offline
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,944
Senior Member

LuBelle
 
LuBelle's Avatar
 
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,944
Senior Member
Unhealthy!
Old 04-06-2013, 08:38 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #23

I think working through a 30 minute lunch period is unhealthy BOTH for students and teachers. Teachers need a break whether they admit it or not, and our students need it as much as they need oxygen to breathe. Of course there will always be those super teachers trying to cram in the knowledge every spare second. Unfortunately the receptacle is not always open... especially during lunch. My last five years of teaching I ate in my classroom while checking school email, preparing for the afternoon, and preparing for meetings right after school. Lots of pressure, lots of stress. I remember earlier years when everyone ate together in the "teachers' lounge"... We talked over problems, shared our lives, and laughed and laughed. We returned to the classroom happy, relaxed, energized, and ready for the afternoon. That kind of lunch is a thing of the past, but bringing it back could make a big difference. 6:15 mandatory meeting? Ridiculous.
LuBelle is offline   Reply With Quote
georgieboy88's Avatar
georgieboy88 georgieboy88 is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 141
Full Member

georgieboy88
 
georgieboy88's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 141
Full Member
We used to do this
Old 04-06-2013, 10:17 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #24

years ago. It didn't help the scores either. It was especially difficult for the teachers with young children too. They had to find other child care because their regular child care wasn't open that early. This is difficult when it's sprung on you without much notice.
georgieboy88 is offline   Reply With Quote
Lady Teacher Lady Teacher is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,323
Senior Member

Lady Teacher
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,323
Senior Member
As teachers
Old 04-06-2013, 10:50 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #25

We need the break too! I have to get out of my classroom and talk with other adults. I will often ask the opinions of fellow teachers in the lunchroom or bounce ideas off of someone. My kids need time to eat and recharge and be ready for the afternoon and so do I. There are several teachers in our building that work during their lunches. It's their choice and I don't judge. But then again, our principal doesn't reward anyone for sucking up to her so none of us do.
Lady Teacher is offline   Reply With Quote
AX Pendergast's Avatar
AX Pendergast AX Pendergast is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member

AX Pendergast
 
AX Pendergast's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member
Interesting...
Old 04-06-2013, 12:53 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #26

Teacherwriter...Not sure how long you've been teaching, or what your status is (tenured, charter school, etc). Be that as it may, I'm having a hard time with your rationalizations about our profession. If I may: (warning:wall of text approaching - proceed with caution )

Quote:
We are supposed to do whatever the job takes, regardless of how long it takes. We agree to do that when we sign our contracts. So where do we, as a profession, get off saying we "shouldn't" have to work outside of contract hours? Where do we get off saying we "shouldn't" have to squeeze in extra help for students? Huh? That's our JOB
Well...it says that in my contract. According to the contract I signed, I have a scheduled set of hours per day that I am compensated for. If I choose to go above/beyond that, it is my choice and I shouldn't expect any pay for it. Every teacher is not predisposed to offer time outside our contract; it's a personal choice. Should I be penalized because I choose to leave 15min after school ends? Why? I have my own family to take care of, I have my own personal business to take care of. Why does that make me a 'bad teacher?'

Personally, I don't help anyone during my lunch. I've already worked 4 straight hours, and have 2.5 more to go...that 30 minutes is mine, and I've very selfish with my personal time. After school, I have generously donated two days a week of my personal time to help students. Guess how many take me up on my offer? Checking my records, since the beginning of school in September, I see that 14 students have chosen to further their understanding of the material. Tell me again why I should be staying after school...

Quote:
Do other professions require this? You bet they do. Just ask any banker or business exec, journalist, physician, nurse, engineer, chef, you name it
Speaking from experience as a former banker, I must refute your claim. My scheduled hours were 730 - 430 every day, with an hour for lunch and two mandated 15-minute breaks. Yes I was a salaried employee and exempt from overtime. And no, I was not required to stay after work to complete tasks. Any work unfinished at 430 was left until the next day. Exceptions: end of the year accounting. Other than that, never.
Doctors, many of whom are self-employed, set their own hours. Nurses - having worked two years in a hospital/school setting, I can say from experience that those nurses were on the floor ONLY when their contract demanded it. They made sure that 15-20 minutes before quitting time they had communicated with their replacement any special instructions.
Can't speak for the others, but I suspect that they also would not agree with your statement.

Quote:
We need to be realistic: Unions are on the way out. (Not sure I like that trend, but too bad--they're not asking me.)
Perhaps in some states, but not everywhere. Here in sunny CA, we're as strong as ever. I realize that in other places, the union climate is not as sunny, but I doubt we're on the way out. Not from the organizing I've seen.

Quote:
If you don't want to do what the job requires, then look for something else in another field. If you want to stay in the profession and keep your job, then figure out how you can do the work and meet the responsibilities in a way that best suits you and your family.
The job requires exactly what our contracts state it requires. Nothing more, nothing less. I love teaching...can't believe I waited so long to get into the profession. I work to my contract three days a week and volunteer an extra hour the other two. Based on my numbers stated above, that may drop to one day a week. If the P or the VP suggests that "I'm not doing my job," then he'll have to take that up with my union rep.

I do agree with your comment regarding kvetching about co-workers. So some of them stay after all week. So they take work home every night. So they host a think tank during their lunch. Good for them. Let them get stressed out and overworked. Everyone else should just take a chill pill and do their best. If you want to go home every day after school, then go! Get the heck out of Dodge and recharge for the next day.
Just be sure to give a cordial wave to the teacher next door as you go.
AX Pendergast is offline   Reply With Quote
georgieboy88's Avatar
georgieboy88 georgieboy88 is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 141
Full Member

georgieboy88
 
georgieboy88's Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 141
Full Member
I also must
Old 04-06-2013, 02:20 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #27

say that ALL teachers should be following Work-to-Rule at all times. If teachers would stick together, then much of this nonsense we are seeing today would never have happened. Even if you are teaching in a non-union state, this needs to be followed. In many ways, teachers themselves have been their own worst enemies. If you fall for the Appeal to Pity, as many teachers will and have (and admin. counts on this), then you devalue the profession. If you think your knowledge and time are worth nothing, then you can expect others to think you have little value.
I sometimes think some teachers would have us go back to Little House on the Prairie times when teachers weren't allowed to be married and had to live with the families of their students because they weren't paid a living wage!

Last edited by georgieboy88; 04-07-2013 at 05:09 AM..
georgieboy88 is offline   Reply With Quote
linda2671's Avatar
linda2671 linda2671 is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member

linda2671
 
linda2671's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member
A different point of view
Old 04-06-2013, 05:39 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #28

I am a part of a grade level that got a grant that allows us all to be Reading Recovery trained. We are taking a 7-credit hour class for which we stay one afternoon a week for 3 1/2 hours, and we tutor our reading recovery students every morning before school, during our plan times, or whenever we can find the time to do it. We are not being paid extra for this, nor are we doing it to be praised or scolded. We are doing it because we have hopes that we can help every child in our grade level read on grade level. No, we are not working to rule. And yes, other teachers roll their eyes whenever anyone mentions what we are doing. We try not to mention it (at all!) because we can feel the angry stares of those who think we are doing it to be kiss-ups and brown-nosers. I know I'm in the minority here, and I'm thinking I probably shouldn't have posted this, but not all teachers do extra to be noticed. Sometimes they just want to feel like they've done everything they can do.
linda2671 is offline   Reply With Quote
kteachsped kteachsped is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
New Member

kteachsped
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
New Member

Old 04-06-2013, 06:01 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #29

I understand that this is a vent, and I'm all for that. In defense of other posters though, i want to say that I agree with teacherwriter and linda2671. Some of the things, like coming in more than an hour early and working through lunch, do sound ridiculous, but in general I think I need to put in as much time as it takes to do my job. There are days I work through lunch and nights I bring hours of work home. It comes with the job. There are also days I leave 10 minutes after the students and nights I do nothing work-related.

I don't think teachers should be penalized for not going above and beyond, but I don't have a problem with rewarding those who do. Also, I'm not sure it's really considered going above and beyond when you work outside of contract hours. I don't know a single effective teacher who doesn't sometimes have to work outside of contract hours in order to do what's right for students. But, that's why we go into teaching, right? Because we want to do what's best kids?

On a final note, I'd like to add this: I don't think we should judge the effort people in other professions put into their jobs (regardless of whether we're saying they work really hard or that they have it easy). We teachers get really PO'ed when others wrongly do this to us. We don't want others to judge us until they've walked in our shoes, and I think we owe other professions the same respect.
kteachsped is offline   Reply With Quote
grav_def grav_def is offline
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,834
Senior Member

grav_def
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,834
Senior Member

Old 04-06-2013, 06:07 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #30

Quote:
We are not being paid extra for this, nor are we doing it to be praised or scolded. We are doing it because we have hopes that we can help every child in our grade level read on grade level.
While that is admirable, I guess the issue with that situation is that something as basic as helping every child read on grade level is something that should be do-able during contract hours. By which I mean, school districts should provide every teacher with the resources--small class sizes, aides, paid training in new curricula/methods that help, etc.--to make that possible during contract hours.

Schools--and our society, by refusing to fund schools--are reneging on that part of the deal, and when teachers step in and use their own resources (time, money) to fill in the gaps, it enables that to continue.
grav_def is offline   Reply With Quote
eeza's Avatar
eeza eeza is offline
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,891
Senior Member

eeza
 
eeza's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,891
Senior Member
contracted hours
Old 04-06-2013, 06:22 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #31

"Something as basic as helping every child read on grade level is something that should be do-able during contract hours. By which I mean, school districts should provide every teacher with the resources--small class sizes, aides, paid training in new curricula/methods that help, etc.--to make that possible during contract hours."

I totally agree with this. Teachers want their students to succeed and if that's not happening during the contracted hours, then there is a systemic problem.

I am now working in special eduction and more students are being referred for special education assessment than before. I think part of it has to do with the information available to parents via the internet so they are more aware of the resources available to them. However, I think part of it has to do with these lack of resources to help those kiddos who are not quite getting it. Previously, these students would be provided with interventions whether it was pull out or small group work in the classroom. Now interventions have been cut and, with class sizes being what they are, students who would have gotten the assistance to just squeak by are now being referred for special ed because they're failing.

This whole thing just makes me sad. The amount of work teachers have to put in to provide for students is more than it should be. Teachers should be provided with the resources so their students can have the opportunity for success.

Last edited by eeza; 04-06-2013 at 06:23 PM.. Reason: forgot to add a title
eeza is offline   Reply With Quote
teachcarolina teachcarolina is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 293
Full Member

teachcarolina
 
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 293
Full Member

Old 04-06-2013, 07:05 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #32

Teaching is also not my first career, so I guess I am a "career changer" as TeacherWriter describes it. I had a very good job before teaching and when people ask me why I left it, I wonder myself now that I know what teaching is really like, but I also know that teaching is what I was meant to do. I also work at a school with a "cliquish" culture and it is very bad for morale, in general. I just decided that what goes on in my class is what counts, not being the "popular" teacher. I happen to know that some of the horn tooting, brown nosers are really full of it! They are some of the biggest complainers behind the scences, but get in front of admin and they are perfect! I agree with grav def that it seems that the more teachers are willing to "give", the more schools are willing to take. I just can't give any more. If you want to be on every commitee and volunteer for every single thing, come in when the sun is rising, leave when it is setting, and skip lunch...go for it. I love my kids and I love being a teacher, but it is not going to "own" me..no job should.
teachcarolina is offline   Reply With Quote
linda2671's Avatar
linda2671 linda2671 is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member

linda2671
 
linda2671's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member

Old 04-06-2013, 07:18 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #33

I just want to add that I have no problem with teachers who want to "teach to the rule". I've taught for 22 years and have seen pull-out programs and mainstream programs, title one and sped. I've never had all of my kids solidly on grade level. This year we have the chance to see that happen, and I don't think we should be looked down on because we want to put forth the extra effort to see it happen, especially since a grant paid thousands of dollars to allow it to happen. If other teachers don't like it, I'm sorry, but we're not doing it to get the approval of other teachers or administrators. We're doing it for the kids.
linda2671 is offline   Reply With Quote
newspedteach newspedteach is online now
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member

newspedteach
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member
Linda
Old 04-06-2013, 07:51 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #34

Quote:
...we want to put forth the extra effort to see it happen, especially since a grant paid thousands of dollars to allow it to happen.
I'm curious, does the grant provide a stipend (or some compensation, besides the training) for the teachers involved?

Also, I have some knowledge of RR, but aren't only the very lowest (maybe 2-3) readers per class able to qualify for the program? So, how does it get all of your kids on grade level?

I'm not trying to be a smart a^^, I'm just curious.


Without getting into what all I think about this (have a lot of thoughts, but agree mostly with the majority of the posters)...but my thought now after reading the last several posts is-teachers can sometimes be their own worst enemies. Overworked (most), underpaid (many), always giving, sometimes to the detriment of their own families. But, have some of you that are giving way beyond your contract time thought about the fact that you may be actually hurting our profession by giving so much of your uncontracted time? Because, if 'we' continue to do so, we won't be taken seriously when we ask for more services for our kids or fight for contract issues. We will be seen, as usual, as part time workers who get summers off....and since many teachers seem to be able to work so many extra hours without complaining, all of us will continue to be expected to do so and will be seen as lazy if we don't give more and more our own time.

Last edited by newspedteach; 04-07-2013 at 07:01 AM..
newspedteach is online now   Reply With Quote
AX Pendergast's Avatar
AX Pendergast AX Pendergast is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member

AX Pendergast
 
AX Pendergast's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member
wrong message?
Old 04-06-2013, 10:28 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #35

kteachsped said:

Quote:
I don't think teachers should be penalized for not going above and beyond, but I don't have a problem with rewarding those who do. Also, I'm not sure it's really considered going above and beyond when you work outside of contract hours. I don't know a single effective teacher who doesn't sometimes have to work outside of contract hours in order to do what's right for students. But, that's why we go into teaching, right? Because we want to do what's best kids?
I do have a problem rewarding those teachers who go above and beyond, especially if those rewards involve special or preferential treatment. If the principal continues to tout the "special abilities" of one teacher over another just because Teacher One holds court after school on his/her own time, that sends a clear message to the teachers who don't - you're not as good a teacher as the others, and how dare you not give up your own time "for the kids."

And there's a difference between "sometimes" working outside of contract and "being expected to" work outside of contract. The former is a choice; the latter is a contract violation.

What's best for the kids? A well-rested, refreshed teacher who is ready to work. Not one who's spent time away from their own life and not enough time having a life.
AX Pendergast is offline   Reply With Quote
kteachsped kteachsped is offline
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
New Member

kteachsped
 
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
New Member
I think I'm looking at it differently.
Old 04-07-2013, 05:59 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #36

I guess I don't see rewarding teachers who go above and beyond as subtly telling them that they are better than everyone else and subtly telling others that they aren't as good. I see it more as a way to say "thank you, you're appreciated." I don't think anyone should be penalized for not going above and beyond, but it makes me happy to know that administrators do recognize when teachers go above and beyond, rather than ignoring it and treating it like it's an expectation.
kteachsped is offline   Reply With Quote
starley's Avatar
starley starley is offline
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,181
Senior Member

starley
 
starley's Avatar
 
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,181
Senior Member

Old 04-07-2013, 06:27 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #37

I am with kteachsped on this one...I say you earned it. Especially, those things I don't want to do. If I wanted to do these extra things, I would do them. I am am a 20 year veteran. I have been the one to do the above and beyond (didn't feel like I got in special treatment ). I am now in a 'season' of my career, where I am well respected. So, I don't have to worry about proving myself, anymore. The above and beyond I do are things I have a passion for and want to do (curriculum, teacher mentoring). I am super glad I have coworkers who are willing to ,make schedules, plan trips, coordinate events...because I sure don't want to
starley is offline   Reply With Quote
Nunziata Nunziata is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,011
Senior Member

Nunziata
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,011
Senior Member
Linda2671
Old 04-07-2013, 07:28 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #38

Thank you for your post. I too do a lot of extra things for my students on my own time. I am not doing anything to impress anyone else. I am doing it because it is what I believe is right for me and for my students.

If anyone said I was a brown-noser I would be furious, because my motivation is the students not the "bosses."

As for working through my 30 minute lunch period with students, I stopped this years ago. It wasn't good for either of us. I need this time to go to the bathroom, wash my hands, make copies, check my mailbox and if lucky maybe get to take a bite or two of my sandwich. There is no time to sit with any student. Most of the time when people work with students or have students with them at lunchtime it is to punish the student. I've had students bring their lunch with them and eat in the classroom with me, but I've stopped this also. I need some time away from students and even other teachers. I need a few minutes to gather my thoughts and breath.

My students need some time away from me also. They need to be able to talk with their friends, especially since the way the day is scheduled they rarely have any down time either.

I do come in early and I do stay late. I also take work home with me each night. Does this mean I am not organized? No, there is just more work than one can do in class with the new requirements, etc. PLUS I like to be prepared and challenge my students. BUT there are many good teachers that work differently than I do and are just as successful. I sometimes wish I were more like them, but I am whom I am, and so be it.

Have I worked with people that ONLY seem to do things to impress the bosses? Yes. Does it annoy me. Yes. Do I know they are doing this for sure? No, but I am assuming they are, which really isn't fair of me.

Have I worked in another career before becoming a teacher? Yes, so I know more about the non-teaching world than most of the people I work with.

Just because I decide to work differently than others doesn't make me a better or a not-so-good teacher.

As far as principals expecting everyone to be the same, that isn't fair, but it is a reality. Just like we as teachers have our favorite students, even though we try not to show it, principals have their favorite teachers. As long as I am doing what I am expected to do and what feels right in my heart then I try really hard not to begrudge anyone else. Sometimes when I have stayed for a meeting and others get thanked, but my name is forgotten, yes I do get hurt, but then I have to remind myself of the true reason I stayed. It was for the students and not for the principal.

The new evaluation systems stink and we all know it. It is going to be very hard for many of us, even the ones that work extra hours, to get Highly Effective based on the wording. We all know the wording was on purpose to try and get rid of teachers and open more for-profit schools, hire non-qualified teachers for less money, etc.

As for unions, I wish my union was strong, but it has become weak in my state and District. Too many of my fellow teachers do not seem to want to be involved, which only weakens it more. I envy those of you that work in a strong union area.

The comment made by another poster about teachers hurting themselves by working longer and harder for no extra pay and it becoming "expected" is a very true comment. The problem I have is how do I not do these extra things and still be an effective teacher? I can't, but I can have a strong union that can help and support me, which I don't have. It is a double-edged sword in my opinion. I feel like I am between the rock and the hard place.

May each of you have a wonderful week at your school.
Nunziata is offline   Reply With Quote
MisterMarcus's Avatar
MisterMarcus MisterMarcus is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 21
New Member

MisterMarcus
 
MisterMarcus's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 21
New Member

Old 04-07-2013, 07:56 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #39

Thank you Nunziata. I am similar. I teach second grade. I differentiate my instruction. I make sure to have centers and well put together plans. I work at least two hours over contract time a day. I work with the kids every minute I have kids. I have. Twenty minutes of specials to plan. That's nothing! To do a good job meeting all those needs, I have to work a lot. Plus I coach the middle school track team in the spring. I work a lot. I do it for my students. Not to brown nose. I know it makes me sound less than manly, and many people automatically assume that I am gay because of my sensitive nature (although I do admit I am a mama's boy with five sisters and no brothers ,which could be the reason) but I would be really hurt and tail tucked if someone thought I worked all those hours just to be a kiss butt. It actually hurt my feelings enough to read it here. I know, over sensitive Marcus AGAIN.

I do think it's unfair to assume that work laters are better teachers, but it's equally mean and judgemental the other way as well.
MisterMarcus is offline   Reply With Quote
sevenplus's Avatar
sevenplus sevenplus is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,214
Senior Member

sevenplus
 
sevenplus's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,214
Senior Member

Old 04-07-2013, 09:22 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #40

I'm just shaking my head here. I really don't know what to say.

The way I look at it, our contractual hours are the hours we are required to be at school. They are not the hours we are expected to complete all work within. I find it hard to believe that any teacher entered the profession thinking otherwise.

I can see how irritating it would be for principals to set certain things as "the new standard" and a teacher shouldn't be frowned upon for not working with students during lunch, for example. And, yes, every teacher has the right to walk in and out of the building at the contracted times.

However, for teachers to be criticized by other teachers for doing more than the minimum??? For their motives to be questioned??? If we don't work to the rule we are harming our profession?

So then what does everyone think about parent volunteers? Teachers who get National Board certification? Where do you draw the line on going "above and beyond?"
sevenplus is offline   Reply With Quote
newspedteach newspedteach is online now
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member

newspedteach
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member
big difference
Old 04-07-2013, 10:18 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #41

Quote:
The way I look at it, our contractual hours are the hours we are required to be at school. They are not the hours we are expected to complete all work within. I find it hard to believe that any teacher entered the profession thinking otherwise.
I think there is a misunderstanding here....at least that's what I see.

I don't think anyone here is saying to never work outside contractual hours. At least I am not! I certainly went into this career with eyes open. I'd just about finished raising my kids when I went back for my sped degree. I'd worked in education for many years. I was well aware of how much 'extra' time I would put into my job and certainly went for it anyway.

I get to school at least 90 minutes before 'contract time' daily. At least 2 days a week, I stay between 30-60 min. later than 'contract time'. This is to attend meetings and to stay as 'caught up' as possible. I used to go to work every Saturday morning and then go home and do more school work. I stopped doing that a couple of years ago. I found that I was super stressed each Monday morning and was never really finished anyway. I don't think most teachers give a second thought to working 'overtime'.

I CHOOSE to work through my 30 min. lunch most of the time, but I'm also eating and listening to the radio during my work. I'd rather not trek to the farthest part of the campus to the lunch room. I need peace and quiet and a breather from both adults and kids for a few sacred minutes. On the days I don't get this....problems with students, phone calls or crises from colleagues or admin, I feel it the rest of the day. I think both teacher and student need time to breathe.

The difference comes in when teachers give up their lunch, planning, and collaboration time to do extra work. What happens (and I've seen this happen) is that it becomes expected and the teachers who say no are often seen as selfish or unwilling to go that extra mile.

I think the OP was venting her frustrations and rightfully so. It's frustrating when we see someone getting accolades for doing what we all do-work hard. It's just that some of us do so quietly and on our own terms. While some others seem to want to let everyone know about it.

DISCLAIMER: By the way, no, not everyone who works through their lunches and plan times wants everyone to know about it or does it to 'suck up' to admin!!
newspedteach is online now   Reply With Quote
Daphne333 Daphne333 is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,019
Senior Member

Daphne333
 
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 3,019
Senior Member
I think this post has strayed
Old 04-07-2013, 10:52 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #42

I don't think the op meant everyone who works beyond contract hours, works with kids outside of classroom time or chooses to use their own time for improving their skills as a teacher are a brown noser. I think she meant those people who do all this stuff for the glory! They want to hear their name called out. They are always sharing their brilliant work or ideas in staff meetings or with the principal.
I think everyone of you can picture 1 or 2 in your building that strive for the praises of the principal and go running to tell every time something great happens. Those are the annoying ones who's voices always get heard. For example, there were some issues during recess so one of those teachers had the brilliant idea for each grade level to go outside and babysit the kids. It didn't matter that we are only allowed 25 minutes for lunch. She was praised as caring for the kids while the teacher that reminded our principal of the contract was looked down on. It shouldn't be that way. Because I know the teacher who pointed out our contract cares for the kids! She's an experienced teacher who is usually the last to leave. Not to mention when she had a horrible situation happen in her family she was right back that night creating lesson plans for the guest teacher. In my opinion she is a very hard working and caring teacher too.
Daphne333 is offline   Reply With Quote
newspedteach newspedteach is online now
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member

newspedteach
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member
I forgot to answer questions
Old 04-07-2013, 10:56 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #43

Quote:
If we don't work to the rule we are harming our profession?
'I' certainly didn't say this. I DO think we are harming our profession if we continually give up our plan times, lunches, collab. time, and more to do what districts, states, etc. should be supporting us to do within the school day. OR compensate us for doing it on an optional/volunteer basis.


Quote:
So then what does everyone think about parent volunteers?
I'm not seeing the correlation . Parents are volunteering to help out their children's school, thus benefiting their own children. Completely different.

Quote:
Teachers who get National Board certification?
In our district/state, teachers who go for NB certs are well compensated. They also receive help with the tuition portion. Also, this is VOLUNTEER. Although NB cert teachers are given accolades, we don't feel pressured to do this...yet. Even if we were pressured, there is monetary compensation, so it's different.

Quote:
Where do you draw the line on going "above and beyond?"
I think I explained this in my other post, above. I think the line is drawn when giving our time is expected. When those who don't give up lunches, planning, personal time, etc...are looked down upon as lazy or inferior teachers.
newspedteach is online now   Reply With Quote
linda2671's Avatar
linda2671 linda2671 is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member

linda2671
 
linda2671's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member
To answer your question, newspedteach...
Old 04-07-2013, 12:28 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #44

Quote:
I'm curious, does the grant provide a stipend (or some compensation, besides the training) for the teachers involved?

Also, I have some knowledge of RR, but aren't only the very lowest (maybe 2-3) readers per class able to qualify for the program? So, how does it get all of your kids on grade level?
The grant does not provide a stipend. We donate our time this year, but we are getting 7 college credits for free. Our administrators have figured out a way for us to be paid for our extra time to do the same thing next year for 1/2 of the year. After that, they have told us that they don't expect us to work for free. They can't pay us for more.
Usually RR only serves 2-3 per class, but because all of us on our grade level are taking the training this year, we are able to take kids that normally would not qualify. Between our grade level teachers and our reading teachers, we are giving RR to 48 kids this year.

We don't work during lunch. We need that time. But we do come in early and stay late. Other teachers HAVE showed their disdain for what we're doing, but they'll be happy when those kids come up through their classes in the coming years.
linda2671 is offline   Reply With Quote
anna's Avatar
anna anna is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 12,545
Senior Member

anna
 
anna's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 12,545
Senior Member

Old 04-07-2013, 12:30 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #45

If we did not have the disingenuous amongst our teaching staffs, we would all be better off. Those that work beyond contract time and then whine about a lack of teacher respect need to look in the mirror.
anna is offline   Reply With Quote
newspedteach newspedteach is online now
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member

newspedteach
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,815
Senior Member
Linda
Old 04-07-2013, 12:35 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #46

Thank you for that explanation .

I think your situation is completely different. As long as it's volunteer (I realize it is) I think it sounds great. As we know, 7 college credits are not cheap. This is compensation, along with deciding what times you want to provide the extra service. It's also important that your district recognizes that they need to pay you next year. I hope it makes a big difference for your students.

I know you're not doing it to suck up. I'm sorry your colleagues can't just mind their own business.
newspedteach is online now   Reply With Quote
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

Old 04-07-2013, 12:38 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #47

I do need to clarify a few things:

#1 I am speaking to specific individuals in our school district who do all sorts of extras so that the principal likes them, invites them out to eat, and gives them accolades. They're the "inner sanctum," above others in the pecking order. There's even competition among them as to who can be in the highest esteem.

#2 I agree with the above poster about how bankers, nurses, and so forth leave at their contracted time. I see this with multiple family members in those professions.

I don't think one has to stay after school to get a lot of things done. I always grade and put the scores in the gradebook after school, but that's done at home. I plan and organize, but that is done at home.

Last edited by EllyTeaches; 04-07-2013 at 12:38 PM.. Reason: adding more info
EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote
linda2671's Avatar
linda2671 linda2671 is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member

linda2671
 
linda2671's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 23,991
Senior Member
Thanks newspedteach
Old 04-07-2013, 12:43 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #48

I appreciate your response. I just wanted to make the point that things may not always be what they seem. We don't feel like our administrators are giving us any special recognition other than to say thank you, and going to bat to get us paid for our extra time next year, but other teachers do roll their eyes. But, like I said, they will appreciate it when their classes are more prepared for the next few years.

Sorry if I hijacked this post. Just saw another point of view.
linda2671 is offline   Reply With Quote
GraceKrispy's Avatar
GraceKrispy GraceKrispy is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 38,073
Blog Entries: 1
Senior Member

GraceKrispy
 
GraceKrispy's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 38,073
Senior Member

Old 04-07-2013, 01:41 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #49

Quote:
The grant does not provide a stipend. We donate our time this year, but we are getting 7 college credits for free.
Nice! That is pretty significant compensation, especially if college credits can be used to move you along in the pay scale. You are getting "paid" in a sense for the extra work.

With regards to the OP, what I really don't like is the expectation that this "above and beyond" has to look a certain way, and has to be visible to the administration. The extra time I put in as a teacher (and I put in a LOT of extra time), was on my own time, in my own way, and didn't necessarily appear obvious to the admin. For example, in addition to the countless hours working on plans and prepping material at home/weekends, I worked with kids in my classroom before school (when P wasn't even there yet), and during recess sometimes. During the one "specials" time I got each week, I actually taught a class, therefore getting no break except lunch.

Without going into too much detail, a few of us had combo grades, and we had it figured out so we could teach all the grades separately for math, and we never had a break from kids, and sometimes had extra kids in our classroom to teach during other subjects.

I worked my butt off in that job. But another teacher, who taught a straight grade, was routinely there until 5pm and was the one always heralded as being such a team player and such a hard worker. My extra time always went "unnoticed." She didn't do it to be a brown noser or to be noticed-- she frequently said she just had trouble working quickly and took that time to gather her thoughts and get a rest from home. And that way she didn't have to take any work home. I have no problem with her approach. I do have a problem with admin heralding her as a super star because of it.
GraceKrispy is offline   Reply With Quote
sevenplus's Avatar
sevenplus sevenplus is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,214
Senior Member

sevenplus
 
sevenplus's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 4,214
Senior Member

Old 04-07-2013, 01:49 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #50

Quote:
I'm not seeing the correlation . Parents are volunteering to help out their children's school, thus benefiting their own children. Completely different.
I made the comment about parent volunteers in response to remarks such as this:

Quote:
Schools--and our society, by refusing to fund schools--are reneging on that part of the deal, and when teachers step in and use their own resources (time, money) to fill in the gaps, it enables that to continue.
Parent volunteers are resources. My point was, where do we draw the line?

If people are turning up their noses at a teacher who choses to work with students during lunch, and others are concerned that if we "give" too much it will come to be expected (or perhaps already has), then I'm just wondering what is the acceptable level of work beyond what is explicitly stated in the contract?

The system is broken. I agree with that. The expectations cannot be achieved. But if I can do more for my students and it isn't hurting my own family, then I'm not going to withhold time, energy, or effort. And, honestly, I would prefer not to get any accolades for it.
sevenplus is offline   Reply With Quote
AX Pendergast's Avatar
AX Pendergast AX Pendergast is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member

AX Pendergast
 
AX Pendergast's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 563
Senior Member
still working out of contract
Old 04-07-2013, 06:36 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #51

Quote:
I don't think one has to stay after school to get a lot of things done. I always grade and put the scores in the gradebook after school, but that's done at home. I plan and organize, but that is done at home.
Whether you're doing it for an hour in your room after school or taking work home and doing it while watching your favorite TV show, you're working out of contract. How soon before you realize that you've been at school for an extra hour and once you get home you're 'back at work?'

Classroom management doesn't just mean how to control the classroom and the students. It also refers to how you manage your time effectively so that work doesn't need to be taken home or done after school.

It took me a few years to realize this...the first time I ignored my kids because I had papers to grade was the last time I graded papers at home. If I don't get to them for an extra day or two, it's not going to hurt anyone.
AX Pendergast is offline   Reply With Quote
Marriedin79's Avatar
Marriedin79 Marriedin79 is offline
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,431
Senior Member

Marriedin79
 
Marriedin79's Avatar
 
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,431
Senior Member
I agree
Old 04-07-2013, 07:08 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #52

I stay late because I want to. Not to make anyone think I'm a super teacher. Not to be a brown nose. Not to be a martyr. Just because I want to.

I enjoy the quiet in my room after a hectic day. I get everything ready for "tomorrow" so that I can walk in with no stress. (Sometimes I am even a bit late - Wait 'til the first time I am scolded for being 5-10 minutes late ... goodbye late hours, hello work-to-the-rule!)

But I rarely (maybe once every 2-3 weeks) bring work home. When I walk out the door, I am done.

I also agree that there seems to be even more work (expectations?) being piled on us. I told someone that if "they" ask me to do A, B, C I will do it. But now we are at X, Y, and Z and nothing else has been taken off our plates. I am a "perfectionist" who cannot let things go. It's a fine line between wanting to do my best (FOR ME) and wanting to spend some time away from the job.
Marriedin79 is offline   Reply With Quote
Realteaches Realteaches is offline
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 96
Full Member

Realteaches
 
Joined: Nov 2012
Posts: 96
Full Member
This post went wild
Old 04-07-2013, 10:04 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #53

Everybody just relax and maintain I feel that this post has really got a little out of control. Almost every teacher I know, including myself, works well beyond their contract hours. I know every weekend I go into work for anywhere from 2-4 hours to get extra prepared for the next week. Then almost every day I stay at least an hour after my contract hours. I know there are thousands of teachers in the same boat.

We all just need to remember what this board is about VENTS. Everybody needs a place to talk about an issue they are having without feeling like they are being attacked for their feelings. ELLYTEACHES, I hope everything turns out fine for you, I am sure it will. I am sorry some people on this board took it upon themselves to turn your vent into an attack. Just keep doing everything you can, and that is all you can do. If you are happy with yourself that is all that matters.
Realteaches is offline   Reply With Quote
amigurumi's Avatar
amigurumi amigurumi is offline
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,056
Senior Member

amigurumi
 
amigurumi's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,056
Senior Member
please forgive me
Old 04-08-2013, 04:55 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #54

if this has been mentioned, as I have not read all posts thoroughly. But it is my experience in working with these overachieving teachers ( for the glory of being recognized and glorified by the Ps) are neglecting other things in their lives. Maybe their children, spouse or other family relationships are being put on the back burner. Quick way to burn out, IMO. There are only so many hours in a day, and we have all worked with these teachers who try to be perfect mom, wife, teacher. Somewhere along the line something has to go, and unfortunately it is the family for many of these teachers who are hell bent on being "the favorite", or at least one of them. Yep, as one PP mentioned, balance is the key.
amigurumi is offline   Reply With Quote
EllyTeaches EllyTeaches is offline
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

EllyTeaches
 
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 328
Full Member

Old 04-08-2013, 01:39 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #55

One thing that bothers me is that I have become a symbol or spokeperson for the "slacker" who doesn't do much. This isn't true. I just draw a line between the expected and the absurd. I also have a specific issue with the "in crowd" being showered with praise by the principal. I am worried about the evaluations.

Another example would be buying of supplies. I think we all would agree that we don't mind buying kleenexes, markers, etc. when we need them. But buying a class set of novels at $200+ would be another matter and would make us pause and wonder why this wasn't a budget item.

I don't think it is possible to do all the grading within the school day, but I do try to use conference period for this purpose to lessen the amount. Usually by the time I get home, I have about 1/3 of the total grading to do.
EllyTeaches is offline   Reply With Quote
violator90 violator90 is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 126
Full Member

violator90
 
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 126
Full Member
It's A Lot Like High School
Old 04-08-2013, 06:33 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #56

It doesn't seem to matter what someone does or doesn't do at my school. You're either in the principal's "in-crowd" or you're not. Then there's the bullying victims. Supposedly happens to someone different EVERY YEAR where I'm at (and at other schools too).

It's like back in high school where you've got your super-popular kid who gets elected to student government/class council/whatever you had. He's not necessarily the best student or the nicest kid, but the one who a lot of people like for whatever reason. Then he spotlights certain students and encourages the popular kids to pick on someone/a group of people. They'll praise the kids in this crowd for athletic achievements, getting into college, etc; then they'll say the "nerd" is "not good enough" because he doesn't wear Abercrombie or something.

Sound like high school? That's how the school I teach at works. The principal is that guy I described. The "in crowd" can do anything, and they can do it well or not so well, and they'll get praised. Everyone else may be decent people, maybe the best people in the school, but they'll get nothing but criticism, accusations, assumptions made about them, subjective evaluations, etc.

Heck, my HIGH SCHOOL was better than this!! Sure, we had a really popular kid as class president, but he was good to everyone. I was actually part of the "in crowd" back then but made a point to be fair to everyone, especially since I was the school announcement dude and got to choose what went on/who got on. Most of the other popular kids were pretty good about this too--my partner on the announcement team could always find something positive to say about someone.

Either I went to a really good high school (could be the case!) or my elementary school that I teach at is indeed populated by people who think they're still 18.
violator90 is offline   Reply With Quote
amherstteach's Avatar
amherstteach amherstteach is offline
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 859
Senior Member

amherstteach
 
amherstteach's Avatar
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 859
Senior Member

Old 04-09-2013, 10:12 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #57

I give up my planning time and lunchtime on a daily basis to help my students. I can't tell you the last time that I ate by myself or have had 5 minutes to myself to plan for that matter. I also stay after school a few times a week when necessary. I do this because I care about my students and want the best for them. If they need me I am there for them...100%. I want them to do well and take their work seriously. I am preparing them for college and life (I teach HS) I am NOT a brown-noser or trying to be better than anyone else. In fact, I doubt my administrators even realize that I give of all of my "free" time because I don't broadcast it to the world. My students know what I do for them and they appreciate it and that is all of the "reward" that I need.
amherstteach is offline   Reply With Quote
eliza4one eliza4one is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,180
Senior Member

eliza4one
 
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,180
Senior Member

Old 04-14-2013, 06:42 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #58

The *why* behind it is important, imo.

Are they trying to suck up to admin? Look good/better than everyone else? Make others look bad? Brown-nose?

Or

Are they doing it with the kids in mind, first and foremost?
As with the PP, I do all of that and more. But, no one knows. No one knows just how much time and effort I put into my students. I work my tail off for them and expect them to do the same for me. I don't work with kids at lunch(recess) daily, but if need be, yep. I do. I hate it, but I do.

I have a coworker who is all about "look at me, me, me". Everything she does has to be broadcast, bigger, better, and brighter than everyone else, e-mailed to all staff, etc. Her idea of collaboration is to e-mail the entire staff (which means the P is on the e-mails) sites she's found, etc. All so he can see she is 'collaborating'. It gets to be a bit much and has totally turned me off.

I know I got a bit off on a tangent. Sorry. Just frustrated with what I'm seeing from this person this year.
eliza4one is offline   Reply With Quote

Join the conversation! Post as a guest or become a member today. New members welcome!

Reply

 

>
The VENT
Thread Tools




Sign Up Now

Sign Up FREE | ProTeacher Help | BusyBoard

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:45 AM.

Copyright © 2019 ProTeacher®
For individual use only. Do not copy, reproduce or transmit.
source: www.proteacher.net