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subasaurus subasaurus is offline
 
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students leave the room when they feel like it
Old 10-18-2019, 10:30 PM
 
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Always bugs me when students leave the room without telling me. They act like they're in college at 13 years old. I'm seeing this a lot more now.

I don't remember students being able to just run out of the room when they felt like it back in the 80's and 90's.

This new generation are allowed to just exit the classroom without even telling the teacher or signing out.

Had three middle schoolers yesterday run out without telling me. Very frustrating, and quite frankly, rude. How am I supposed to keep track of kids this way? As a sub, this makes the job a major liability.

Perhaps schools are letting the kids do what they want now.

Are schools promoting anarchy and disrespect to adults?



Last edited by subasaurus; 10-18-2019 at 10:46 PM..
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Old 10-19-2019, 03:51 AM
 
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Just because they do it doesnít mean it is allowed.

Whenever students leave without permission, it is written up as skipping class. I havenít had any kids leave my room without permission this year, but this group has a few kids who have done that with one of their specials teachers. They are just being jerks. It didnít work well for them. They are being better behaved now.
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Maybe?
Old 10-19-2019, 03:54 AM
 
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I don't think schools (at least the ones I'm familiar with) are creating anarchy and disrespect intentionally. I do agree that "keeping track" of kids is getting tougher. But it's not totally the kids' fault.

There are more "reasons" to leave the classroom today than several decades ago. One thing that I see happening is kids have certain routines and they tend to follow them without much fanfare. The regular teacher may or may not note this on the lesson plan--he or she is just accustomed to it. So we end up with "Hey! Where's Sally?" -- and the kids explain, "Oh she always goes to... on Tuesdays."

We are giving kids more freedom at younger ages. There's been a growing trend (which I support and use) towards "shared classroom management" which makes the teacher less of a taskmaster and enforcer. The challenge is that different teachers do have different levels of "sharing" or permissiveness. It's another case where we have to "mindread" the regular teacher's practices. I once subbed in a kindergarten class where the kids were allowed to leave the room pretty much as they pleased (no bathroom or water fountain in the room)! They were supposed to put a plastic cone on their desk indicating they were gone--not particularly helpful if it became necessary to find them! And at least 25% of the time, they'd "forget" to put the cone up.

There's some obvious age dependence.

I can think of one school where admin has the belief that middle schoolers should be much more self-directed and has instructed teachers to lighten up on enforcing rules about hall behavior since the kids "should know better." The kids have it figured out and are leveraging it. Testing limits is, after all, part of growing up. The question it raises in my mind is whether or not they have the skills and maturity to be so. As a sub, I often "change the rules" for the day, explaining to the kids that I expect to have some idea of where they are at all times. It seems to help, but they also "forget" because it's tough to change a habit for a day.

I've occasionally thought that someone should invent a GPS tracker button that we could pin on the littles, at least while we're subbing.
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leaving the room
Old 10-19-2019, 05:43 AM
 
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Quote:
Are schools promoting anarchy and disrespect to adults?
Tough call. I need them to respect me, but I also feel like I'm not respecting them if I don't let them do something as simple as go to the bathroom when they need to.

So I usually just remind them that I absolutely need to know where they are going, just in case of an emergency drill, but that I am very unlikely to say no.


Quote:
I've occasionally thought that someone should invent a GPS tracker button that we could pin on the littles, at least while we're subbing.
...like the magic bands at Disney World - tap them on a door pad when they leave, and then again at their destination.

Sigh...another thing to go on my "perfectly funded dream school" list.
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@ima teacher
Old 10-19-2019, 06:38 AM
 
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"Just because they do it doesn’t mean it is allowed."

I'm just saying I'm seeing kids defy this rule a lot more often than a decade ago. Makes me believe schools are becoming more lenient regarding students coming and going as they please.

Many schools I sub at allow students to pick up breakfast and arrive late if they desire. It's not necessarily students just taking advantage of having a sub in the room.


"They are just being jerks."

True, but schools (at least the ones I sub at) don't seem to be cracking down as much on "stragglers" like they used to from my experiences.

Perhaps your school is a well-oiled machine. If so, I am jealous


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@maine sub
Old 10-19-2019, 06:39 AM
 
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There are more "reasons" to leave the classroom today than several decades ago.

I think you nailed it with this explanation. This is exactly where the problem stems.
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@lakeside
Old 10-19-2019, 06:43 AM
 
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...like the magic bands at Disney World - tap them on a door pad when they leave, and then again at their destination.


Lol. Now we're talking
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Old 10-19-2019, 09:00 AM
 
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I've also seen the little ones put the cones on their desks to signify they've gone to the restroom. However, I don't know that's a rule and I end up wondering where they are. Then the other students have to tell me. Then 2 or 3 of them have cones on their desk, (usually no more than 3). I've even told them not to leave without telling me. I understand it's promoting independence, and less of a hassle for the teacher, but please put it in the lesson plans!
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Old 10-19-2019, 09:25 AM
 
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Depends on the school district. This one that has security guards has a problem with kids roaming the hallways and they do nothing about it because they're lazy.

Other schools, the kids fear leaving the room, which was like my school. I was NEVER in the hallway in high school. I never used the bathroom at school anyways. Other kids live there.

Really and truly, it is quite often not the sub or teacher's fault for student behavior. It's the school administration in general. I used to work with and manage kids from the high school I'm working at now. It's been ten years, different kids, but they still behave the same way they did at my workplace. It's the culture. They would not show up to work whenever they wanted, they would disrespect anyone in authority for having the nerve to give them a job, they would go smoke whenever they felt like it. At school, they get a million chances and excuses thanks to the snake oil professionals who don't actually work in classrooms but are lucky enough to get stupid administrators and teachers to pay for their advice. At work, they showed up to the counter, gave their usual bogus apologies thinking they would get away with it. We just told them they weren't employed there anymore! No need for a overpaid education or professor's bogus theories, they were fired and out of our workplace! We got rid of the whole lot of them and hired kids from another high school who took their job more seriously but ironically were from families where they didn't need the money.

Many of the bad kids I was talking about came from union families too. It explained a lot about globalization, I'm sorry. How can you blame anyone for moving their factory to China when you have to deal with workers like this? If you watch that documentary "American Factory" on Netflix, it pretty much says it all. The American workers are sloppy, eyes are dull, not interested in listening to anyone or being organized, the Chinese workers lined up, eyes focused on the boss, listening to everything he said. On the show, the CEO talked about how he absolutely didn't want a union in the US plant, but in China, they had one! I interpreted that to mean that American workers abused their unions and therefore couldn't be trusted to have the privilege of one...my opinion.
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my out of the room policy
Old 10-19-2019, 03:01 PM
 
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I sub strictly in grades 3 - 7. I only allow one kid out to the bathroom at a time. As soon as they find out that the can't leave with their friend to goof off in the hallway, they don't "need to go" anymore.


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Old 10-23-2019, 04:15 AM
 
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Seconding that it depends on the district, the students, and the rules of that particular classroom. I've taught in classes where the teacher's bathroom system was to just have the kids write their names on the board and then exit without even asking, since the bathrooms happened to be located right outside the classroom anyway. Personally I don't mind it at the high school level, but anywhere lower than that and I get really concerned and overprotective.
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Old 10-24-2019, 02:12 PM
 
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"Are schools promoting anarchy and disrespect to adults?"
The schools don't have to: just look at what the kids are reading, and watching on TV and big screen.
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Old 10-24-2019, 06:32 PM
 
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Quote:
Perhaps your school is a well-oiled machine. If so, I am jealous
We are pretty good.

We try really hard to be consistent as a team, and we try to make sure subs know the routines. We like to get the same subs, too. Makes for more consistency.
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