Practicing procedure is supposed to work, right? - ProTeacher Community




Home Join Now Search My Favorites
Help


      Classroom Management

Practicing procedure is supposed to work, right?

>

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Kishkumen Kishkumen is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member

Kishkumen
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member
Practicing procedure is supposed to work, right?
Old 04-23-2019, 05:52 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #1

I was told to practice procedures, practice procedures, practice procedures. So when a 5th grade class refused to line up without running and shouting, I had them sit down and do it again. and again. and again. Then their teacher picked them up, and I picked up the mess they had hidden (they simply stuffed the trash into the pencil cups, and kicked the mess from one table to another until every table had lined up.

So this week, I had the students line up, sit down, line up, sit down. The point is to "show that you really mean it" as everyone tells me. So after doing that twice, I let most of the tables stay seated and free draw while three noisy tables lined up again, and again, and again. Oh, they had a fabulous time! they got to run in the classroom, make funny walks, chat with their friends in line, mouth off to their teacher, yell, refuse to line up entirely, and throw things (one student chucked her backpack clean across the room when I insisted she had to leave it on the front of the room like everyone else). It took about a dozen times, with whole tables and individual students. The more we practiced, the worse it got. It lasted about twenty minutes of my forty minute class, until I had to devote all my attention to the backpack-chucker (who has been written up for defiance half a dozen times this year). The rest of the students at those tables got to sit and practice being quiet for the remainder of the class.

According to everyone, I'm supposed to practice procedures "until they get it right". What happens when this backfires and I end up with the aforementioned power struggle? Do I give up and let them "win"? Or do I keep practicing for the rest of the class and make the students enjoy the defiance?

This class has been like this all year, and no matter how much I try Harry Wong or Fred Jones, nothing works.


Kishkumen is offline   Reply With Quote

Ima Teacher's Avatar
Ima Teacher Ima Teacher is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Ima Teacher
 
Ima Teacher's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Old 04-27-2019, 03:27 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #2

At the point where they are refusing to practice correctly , they need consequences for misbehavior.
Ima Teacher is offline   Reply With Quote
Kishkumen Kishkumen is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member

Kishkumen
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member

Old 04-27-2019, 06:16 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #3

yeah, that's what I've been telling Admin. They've asked me to write fewer detentions and make fewer e-mails home, because it makes the PBIS numbers look bad
Kishkumen is offline   Reply With Quote
Ima Teacher's Avatar
Ima Teacher Ima Teacher is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Ima Teacher
 
Ima Teacher's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Old 04-27-2019, 08:14 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #4

They must be using PBIS differently. We are encouraged to contact parents and keep detention. That keeps kids out of the Office.
Ima Teacher is offline   Reply With Quote
SunshineAlway
 
 
Guest

SunshineAlway
 
 
Guest

Old 04-28-2019, 05:22 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #5

You may want to consider not allowing backpacks inside the classroom. Put them all in a closet, corner as they enter. Have a bucket full of pencils and give them paper for each written assignments. Collect everything at the end of class. They collect their backpacks as they leave.

Just an idea.


  Reply With Quote
Kishkumen Kishkumen is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member

Kishkumen
 
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 124
Full Member

Old 04-28-2019, 09:16 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #6

I've talked to the admin, and backpacks can't be put in the hallway. Because 5th grade leaves for busses, walking, and parent pickup immediately after specials, they have to have their backpacks with them when they enter my class.

So I've done the next best thing and had them put their packs against the wall, but every day there are a half-dozen students who think they are the exception to the rules. They'll just take their packs to their seats, then ignore me, try to argue, or try to bargain with me, and then some try to sneak them back to their tables during class.

I was encouraged to use the established PBIS procedures. When they didn't work, the admin told me I just needed to be "consistent". When I had to write a half-dozen lunch detentions for gum, safety issues, and defiance, Admin told to stop doing those procedures.. When I explained that detentions didn't even compare to the number of e-mails sent home, and that detentions were the last resort, I was told to stop sending e-mails home as well.

Whatever I try, admin tells me I can't do that.
Kishkumen is offline   Reply With Quote
Ima Teacher's Avatar
Ima Teacher Ima Teacher is offline
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Ima Teacher
 
Ima Teacher's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 27,371
Senior Member

Old 04-29-2019, 05:01 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #7

How do students behave the rest of the day?
Ima Teacher is offline   Reply With Quote
Fenwick Fenwick is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 373
Senior Member

Fenwick
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 373
Senior Member

Old 04-29-2019, 07:29 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #8

Does your school have a Student Handbook which includes School Discipline Code?
Fenwick is offline   Reply With Quote
SunshineAlway
 
 
Guest

SunshineAlway
 
 
Guest

Old 04-30-2019, 05:52 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #9

I am so sorry to hear that. It would be perfect if you had a closet or a utility room in your classroom. I would make sure to lock the back packs in. May be several huge carboard boxes would do the trick. If they dump all of their backpacks in and you close it, they would have a hard time retrieving it.
Tell them that everyone retrieves the backpacks at the same time. If something is lost, the person who got into the box gets the blame automatically.

I have one hard to control classroom like you describe. I can not imagine having 30 classes like these each week. I hope you are taking care of yourself. I bet you need a lot of rest. I do. When I get home, I sleep a lot after having this particular class. Everything is an opportunity to disrupt for this class.

Are you allowed to give any consequences for misbehavior????
1. Writing a reflection letter
2. Writing an apology letter
3. Writing the rule broken over and over again
4. Turn their seats around.
5. Staying after school and cleaning your classroom. I would purposely dump extra trash that day.
6. Wipe the tables, books, shelves until your satisfaction
7. The consequence is really having to stay late or lose time with friends when no one is there.
8. If they rip or write on a book, immediately inform and ask the bookkeeper to send the invoice home.

I am sorry about your situation. I'm in a similar school. They want good grades, no referrals, no phone calls, no punishments, everything is a reward, put on a smile even when they are doing wrong and so on.
  Reply With Quote
Fenwick Fenwick is offline
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 373
Senior Member

Fenwick
 
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 373
Senior Member

Old 05-01-2019, 02:12 PM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #10

Quote:
So I've done the next best thing and had them put their packs against the wall, but every day there are a half-dozen students who think they are the exception to the rules. They'll just take their packs to their seats, then ignore me, try to argue, or try to bargain with me, and then some try to sneak them back to their tables during class.
Do you have any type of incentive (motivation) that answers question for students, "Why should I?" In this case, "Why should I put my backpack by the wall as you ask?" Some teachers use Responsibility Training with PAT. RT done correctly elicits the power of peers to do discipline for you. If you have PAT in place Teacher Bonus can be used to motivate (incentive) the half-dozen. Might look something like this:

"Class you have 20 minutes of PAT. You can earn more PAT by saving me time to teach. When you come into class I will watch to see how many backpacks are not against the wall. If there are none, everyone has put their backpack as I directed, you will earn a Teacher Bonus of three minutes added to your PAT. That's 23 minutes of PAT. Let's all help each other to make sure you earn your extra PAT." Typically, if a student starts to take their backpack to their seat another student will say, "Hey! Put it against the wall. We want extra PAT!" In this case, in order to be noticed and popular (peer relationship) most students comply. If a student doesn't no time is subtracted from PAT. The class just doesn't earn extra time.


Fenwick is offline   Reply With Quote
OccupationFoo OccupationFoo is offline
 
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 6
New Member

OccupationFoo
 
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 6
New Member
It does work
Old 06-07-2019, 06:24 AM
 
Clip to ScrapBook #11

I have been reading your posts the last two days because I can sympathize as the end of the year was a bummer. It started out great, but the last month was very tough and it was mostly my fault. One or two are due to parent apathy/denial, but mostly it falls back on the teacher.

I stayed true to a discipline plan, but as the year went on, I relaxed a bit. That was my mistake. The kids will pick up on this. So I know for next year, I must stick to the plan and not waver.

In the past, I've started out with a probationary period, but that was a mistake because when I would go to enforcement, it was too late.

And this year was better than last. Just have to be consistent and make sure the kids are kept busy.
OccupationFoo is offline   Reply With Quote

Join the conversation! Post as a guest or become a member today. New members welcome!

Reply

 

>
Classroom Management
Thread Tools




Sign Up Now

Sign Up FREE | ProTeacher Help | BusyBoard

All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:01 AM.

Copyright © 2019 ProTeacher®
For individual use only. Do not copy, reproduce or transmit.
source: www.proteacher.net